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Science Fiction > Fandom > Re: Not always ...
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Re: Not always joking, it seems

by David Friedman <ddfr@[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Feb 15, 2008 at 01:12 PM

In article 
<d039bc79-e45e-4e34-b564-74d55eb5a974@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>,
 Willie.Mookie@[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 wrote:

....

> I was reflecting on what Skinner said about society being like a big
> Skinner machine you cannot escape. The whole of society becomes a
> large reinforcement schedule that promises rich rewards throughout but
> in reality, takes everything from you that you've got and play ends
> when you are broke.
> 
> The more efficient we become along this path, the bleaker things will
> be - and in the end, large populations of lucky and unlucky folk alike
> will have become desensitized to the messages used to fleece them - by
> and large those messages are the fabric that holds society together.
> At that point all hell will break loose.

How, on this theory, do you explain that by any objective measure--life 
expectancy, real income, calorie consumption, health--things have been 
getting generally better in most of the world for the past several 
centuries? Murder rates have gone up and down, and historical data on 
crime rates isn't all that good, but it seems clear that murder is much 
less common than it was five or six hundred years ago.

-- 
 http://www.daviddfriedman.com/
http://daviddfriedman.blogspot.com/
 Author of _Harald_, a fantasy without magic.
 Published by Baen, in bookstores now
 




 96 Posts in Topic:
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Willie.Mookie@[EMAIL PROT  2008-02-15 13:03:31 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
David Friedman <ddfr@[  2008-02-15 13:12:43 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
dbd@[EMAIL PROTECTED] (D  2008-02-15 18:11:20 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"Dimensional Travele  2008-02-15 17:33:16 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Edward McArdle <mcardl  2008-02-16 11:00:30 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"Keith F. Lynch"  2008-02-15 19:34:43 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"Karl Johanson"  2008-02-16 02:03:22 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"Keith F. Lynch"  2008-02-15 21:07:55 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Tim Merrigan <tppm@[EM  2008-02-15 19:24:30 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
David Harmon <source@[  2008-02-15 23:48:19 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Jette <bosslady@[EMAIL  2008-02-16 08:44:26 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"Keith F. Lynch"  2008-02-16 13:09:56 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
David Friedman <ddfr@[  2008-02-16 10:15:51 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Jette <bosslady@[EMAIL  2008-02-16 18:19:31 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Jette <bosslady@[EMAIL  2008-02-16 18:18:10 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
goldfarb@[EMAIL PROTECTED  2008-02-16 19:56:06 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
throopw@[EMAIL PROTECTED]  2008-02-19 07:16:04 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Gutless Umbrella Carrying  2008-02-19 17:26:52 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Gutless Umbrella Carrying  2008-02-16 00:14:21 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Sean O'Hara <seanohara  2008-02-15 21:37:50 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
David Friedman <ddfr@[  2008-02-15 18:59:43 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Terry Austin <taustinc  2008-02-16 05:50:33 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
dbd@[EMAIL PROTECTED] (D  2008-02-16 03:37:20 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Bill Snyder <bsnyder@[  2008-02-16 04:52:10 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Gene Ward Smith <gene@  2008-02-16 18:24:21 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Terry Austin <taustinc  2008-02-16 22:32:22 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Kip Williams <kiptw@[E  2008-02-17 18:13:42 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Sean O'Hara <seanohara  2008-02-16 16:37:50 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
David Friedman <ddfr@[  2008-02-16 14:17:22 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Terry Austin <taustinc  2008-02-16 05:49:55 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"Keith F. Lynch"  2008-02-15 19:47:05 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Tim Merrigan <tppm@[EM  2008-02-15 19:29:54 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"Marcus L. Rowland&q  2008-02-19 08:35:43 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
mike weber <fairportfa  2008-02-19 12:27:26 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
David Friedman <ddfr@[  2008-02-19 12:15:09 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"Dimensional Travele  2008-02-19 20:36:42 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
William Hyde <wthyde19  2008-02-19 09:46:25 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
David McMillan <spamtr  2008-02-23 20:45:26 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"pullo" <pul  2008-02-24 04:02:10 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"AJ" <tortur  2008-02-24 05:32:26 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"pullo" <pul  2008-02-24 06:13:59 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
David Harmon <source@[  2008-02-24 18:03:43 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"pullo" <pul  2008-02-25 06:37:58 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"Keith F. Lynch"  2008-02-25 20:27:12 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
David McMillan <spamtr  2008-02-25 15:12:01 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"Jay E. Morris"  2008-02-25 03:43:30 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"pullo" <pul  2008-02-25 06:40:26 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"Jay E. Morris"  2008-02-26 01:24:14 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"pullo" <pul  2008-02-26 19:51:25 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"Jay E. Morris"  2008-02-28 01:48:08 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"pullo" <pul  2008-02-27 21:01:36 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"Jay E. Morris"  2008-03-01 21:04:11 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
sethb@[EMAIL PROTECTED]   2008-03-02 21:04:28 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"pullo" <pul  2008-03-02 22:45:34 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"Keith F. Lynch"  2008-03-03 20:12:43 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
David McMillan <spamtr  2008-02-25 15:15:02 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
David McMillan <spamtr  2008-02-25 14:52:11 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"pullo" <pul  2008-02-26 20:09:10 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"Karl Johanson"  2008-02-24 18:50:44 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"Marcus L. Rowland&q  2008-02-19 22:40:52 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
wdstarr@[EMAIL PROTECTED]  2008-02-19 20:23:49 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
mike weber <fairportfa  2008-02-19 22:38:28 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"Mike Schilling"  2008-02-19 19:44:36 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
mike weber <fairportfa  2008-02-19 23:44:43 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Jette <bosslady@[EMAIL  2008-02-20 16:38:56 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
mike weber <fairportfa  2008-02-19 22:37:43 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Robert Sneddon <fred@[  2008-02-20 20:37:22 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
lathamr@[EMAIL PROTECTED]  2008-02-21 13:35:53 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
mike weber <fairportfa  2008-02-21 18:58:30 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"Mike Schilling"  2008-02-22 00:05:37 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
dbd@[EMAIL PROTECTED] (D  2008-02-21 20:10:16 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"Mike Schilling"  2008-02-21 16:53:59 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Kurt Busiek <kurt@[EMA  2008-02-21 16:57:40 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
mike weber <fairportfa  2008-02-22 08:14:16 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Gene Ward Smith <gene@  2008-02-22 00:22:55 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Robert Sneddon <fred@[  2008-02-20 20:44:57 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
mike weber <fairportfa  2008-02-20 19:56:40 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
ken65@[EMAIL PROTECTED]   2008-02-20 14:02:55 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Gutless Umbrella Carrying  2008-02-20 22:24:03 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
ken65@[EMAIL PROTECTED]   2008-02-22 12:43:53 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Gutless Umbrella Carrying  2008-02-22 21:28:26 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
dbd@[EMAIL PROTECTED] (D  2008-02-22 20:58:54 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"Keith F. Lynch"  2008-02-22 20:39:27 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Sean O'Hara <seanohara  2008-02-23 13:15:21 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
sethb@[EMAIL PROTECTED]   2008-02-26 19:52:42 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
ken65@[EMAIL PROTECTED]   2008-02-20 14:44:08 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Gutless Umbrella Carrying  2008-02-20 23:20:58 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Bill Snyder <bsnyder@[  2008-02-20 18:11:10 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
ken65@[EMAIL PROTECTED]   2008-02-23 06:51:15 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
ken65@[EMAIL PROTECTED]   2008-02-21 10:31:06 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Gutless Umbrella Carrying  2008-02-21 18:41:34 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Bill Snyder <bsnyder@[  2008-02-21 12:47:41 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Gutless Umbrella Carrying  2008-02-21 18:58:48 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
"louann_m@[EMAIL PRO  2008-02-22 15:26:46 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
Robert Sneddon <fred@[  2008-02-26 11:20:52 
Re: Not always joking, it seems
dbell@[EMAIL PROTECTED]   2008-02-28 07:35:22 

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tan13V112 Wed Jul 23 16:20:32 CDT 2008.